Posted November 12, 2026
Ross Douthat is a conservative Catholic journalist who wrote for The New York Times for many years before recently moving to CBS. I have followed his work with great gratitude; our ministry reviewed his latest book and hosted him on our podcast as well.
Mr. Douthat recently interviewed President Trump on 60 Minutes, a conversation that has generated much discussion this week. Toward its end, he asked the president, “What do you think happens to Donald Trump when you die?” Mr. Trump replied, “Well, I’m a religious person, so in theory I go to heaven.” Mr. Douthat then clarified, “Do you think you’re going to heaven?” Mr. Trump responded, “I hope so. I don’t want to go to hell.”
Mr. Douthat then turned to the subject of forgiveness, asking: “Let’s say you pass away, you’re entering the next life, and all you have to do to enter paradise is feel love and forgiveness for James Comey, Nancy Pelosi, anyone who you have expressed hate for over the years. Do you think you can do it?”
After a back-and-forth on the subject, Mr. Trump said, “Honestly, Ross, can I—can I be honest?” Mr. Douthat replied, “That’s why I asked it. Yes.” To which the president said, “I probably cannot do that, no, because I do hate some of my enemies and I always will.”
Let’s begin at the beginning: We go to heaven not because we are religious but because we trust Jesus Christ to forgive our sins and be our Savior and Lord.
He died for us when God “made him to be sin who knew no sin, so that in him we might become the righteousness of God” (2 Corinthians 5:21). Our salvation is based not on what we do but on what Jesus has done: “By grace you have been saved through faith. And this is not your own doing; it is the gift of God, not a result of works, so that no one may boast” (Ephesians 2:8–9). The Bible is clear: If Donald Trump has trusted in Christ as his Lord and Savior, he is the child of God (John 1:12); if he has not, he is not. The same is true of every human, you and me included.
With regard to forgiving others, however, the issue is more nuanced.
Jesus taught us, “If your brother sins, rebuke him, and if he repents, forgiven him, and if he sins against you seven times in the day, and turns to you seven times, saying, ‘I repent,’ you must forgive him” (Luke 17:3–4). By this measure, unless James Comey, Nancy Pelosi, or Mr. Trump’s other political opponents repent, he has no obligation to forgive them.
However, this is not all Jesus said on the subject. He also taught us to “love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you” (Matthew 5:44). He modeled such love at the cross by praying for his executioners, “Father, forgive them, for they know not what they do” (Luke 23:34). Stephen similarly prayed for those stoning him to death, “Lord, do not hold this sin against them” (Acts 7:60). In neither case did the objects of their intercession demonstrate repentance prior to their forgiveness.
So we can know that we are to forgive those who repent as well as those who do not. Paul was clear: “As the Lord has forgiven you, so you also must forgive” (Colossians 3:13).
There is also the question of relating God’s forgiveness of us to our forgiveness of others. Jesus taught us to pray, “Forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors” (Matthew 6:12). He added, “whenever you stand praying, forgive, if you have anything against anyone, so that your Father also who is in heaven may forgive your trespasses” (Mark 11:25).
On the surface, it seems that God will only forgive us if we forgive others. And yet, as I noted earlier, our salvation is by grace, not works. How do we reconcile this contradiction?
James stated that “faith apart from works is dead” (James 2:26). John Calvin likewise noted that we are saved by faith alone, “but not by a faith which is empty or destitute of good works.”
It’s not that forgiving others earns God’s forgiveness. Rather, our forgiveness of others reveals the condition of our heart. Jesus taught, “Whoever abides in me and I in him, he it is that bears much fruit, for apart from me you can do nothing” (John 15:5). The closer we are to him, the more we experience his grace and want to share it with others.
If we are legalistic and vengeful, our spirit is far from our Father who “is” love (1 John 4:8). If our fist is clenched toward them, it is also clenched toward him. Forgiving others positions us to receive the forgiveness of God.
How, then, can we find it in our heart to forgive and thus to experience forgiveness?
In his interview, Ross Douthat asked the president if he could “feel love and forgiveness” for his enemies. However, God’s word nowhere tells us how forgiveness feels. This is because biblical forgiveness is an action, not a feeling.
In Forgive and Forget: Healing the Hurts We Don’t Deserve, ethicist Lewis Smedes explains that forgiving someone does not mean that we excuse their behavior, pretend they didn’t hurt us, or forget what they did. Rather, biblical forgiveness is pardon, defined as the decision not to punish. A governor who pardons a criminal does not excuse their crime but chooses not to punish as the law provides.
This is an expression of agape, the unconditional love that God’s Spirit produces in our lives when we are fully submitted to him (Galatians 5:22; Ephesians 5:18). It is a transformative gift we can then give to those who need our forgiveness, and to ourselves as well. As Dr. Smedes noted,
“To forgive is to set a prisoner free and discover that the prisoner was you.”
Do you need such freedom today?
“The man who is truly forgiven and knows it, is a man who forgives.” —D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones
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